How to stop scamming? Try this

[Figjam]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

AFAIK none of the mods are paid. Worth remembering.

[Desert.Express]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Let me see how many of these posts you've reported in the last few weeks...

Well, going back to mid July, it's zero!

I will say, however, that it's not mandatory for pictures in non-gun threads

Ok I'll do.

But, are you just waiting for someone to report these threads or would you check it out yourself once in a while?

Because, I do understand if a few threads slip under mods control, but I've seen many that break the "name and date" rule being not removed after several days; if you're just waiting for other people to report all the threads because you're too busy with something else..well, just hire someone to do only that work.

It's kind of ridiculous that you tell me "how many threads you reported? Zero", because I'm no mod and don't check any single thread; this should be your work lol.

Well after this I'm done, if you can't even manage to check the threads and remove promptly the rule-breaking ones, imagine what would mean to check any single paypal account

The funny thing is that I got a thread removed once because there was no forum name in the pic, even if the background was the same I use for almost any picture I take; and it was istant, while in the same section (accessories for sale) there are many threads even without pictures that are not removed!

What can I say about that..

[Fizzy]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Its a community problem. If people actually worked the system the system would work. Hit dislike and report threads that look suspect for a start. I've never felt like I was banging my head against a wall with mods, but then any time I've contacted a mod I've made sure its one that is online.

It is indeed a community problem. I've seen a fair few posts along the lines of "I knew it was a scam as soon as I saw the thread" yet the thread wasn't reported as being suspicious, and they're happy to bang on afterwards about they knew it was a scam. SO why not help out your fellow airsofters and report it instead of trying to play hero AFTER the event?

There are threads even without the forum name, that are not removed.

Let me see how many of these posts you've reported in the last few weeks...

Well, going back to mid July, it's zero!

I will say, however, that it's not mandatory for pictures in non-gun threads

[Figjam]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Its a community problem. If people actually worked the system the system would work. Hit dislike and report threads that look suspect for a start. I've never felt like I was banging my head against a wall with mods, but then any time I've contacted a mod I've made sure its one that is online.

[mad.matt]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Minimum post count also doesn't work.

You've got it on Driftworks for one: all you see is someone posting on 30 different build threads within 30 minutes saying "Cool build man!" or words to that effect.
The fact is, the Mods are thin on the ground for what is one of the most active airsoft forums in the UK and unfortunately, things to fall through the net.

I think if ZOne want to impose the "no alternate advertising rule", then they need to have a closer relationship with the forum.

[Desert.Express]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Sorry side not, post in classifieds with name done on MS paint, see how long/ if it gets removed

Edit, perhaps also we should do a poll to see if some sort of count or verification Is wanted by the community?

There are threads even without the forum name, that are not removed.

[HuntR]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Post count will never happen, as it could potentially penalise someone who is 100% genuine. And verification will never happen either due to the Data Protection Act being in place.

[Muzlie]

How to stop scamming? Try this

Sorry side not, post in classifieds with name done on MS paint, see how long/ if it gets removed

Edit, perhaps also we should do a poll to see if some sort of count or verification Is wanted by the community?

[Desert.Express]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

1- If its too good to be true it is
2- If the seller has just joined, has no feedback and the first thing they are selling is a £400 gun...chances are its a scam

I've started selling expensive stuff here since I was an unknown overseas seller, and look at my feedbacks now.

The thing someone with no feedbacks starts selling expensive stuff as soon as he joins the community, doesn't mean he has to be a con man anytime.

As Montague says, the first step to avoid scams is to make people respect the "forum name" rule when they take pics of what they're selling, not allowing to use photoshop'd names.

Then, as I'm suggesting, to make sure any subscriber has a full verified Paypal account and can't receive money other than via Paypal, before they reach 25 positive feedbacks and a certain amount of x£ worth stuff sold. (my idea is £1000 but it can be £500 too, because in any case a trader has to satisfy both requirements before being able to use other payment methods, and even if you get to £500-1000 quickly it's a long way to go through for 25 positive feedbacks from 25 different members)

- - - Updated - - -

We don't need any counts or limits, if you see anything suspicious or that doesn't abide by forum rules report to a moderator, and most importantly don't buy it! Simple!

(And sorry mods but perhaps you need to be a bit more Johnny on the spot? Or recruit some more?)

Yes we do, because as I said before how can you state something is suspicious (or not) with certainty?

In the early stages of my trader activity here, I've sold PTWs and other expensive stuff with no feedbacks or a few ones..there was no scam, obviously, as you can see by having a look at my feedbacks.

So, since you never can't tell if someone is genuine or not (apart from exceptional cases), the kind of rules I'm proposing could make this place safer for traders before anyone starts selling anything here; if there's someone who doesn't satisfy those requirements, can't even enter, according to my point of view.

But, if you have nothing to hide, you can just be happy to give any possible proof you're genuine (as you do with Paypal) to have certain benefits in return (like having the chance to sell/buy stuff in one of the biggest european airsoft communities, which is this place).

And you're double happy because you know you're surrounded by a majority of genuine people, because it would be very difficult for scammers to deal with this place if they have to follow so many restrictive rules.

[Muzlie]

How to stop scamming? Try this

We don't need any counts or limits, if you see anything suspicious or that doesn't abide by forum rules report to a moderator, and most importantly don't buy it! Simple!

(And sorry mods but perhaps you need to be a bit more Johnny on the spot? Or recruit some more?)

[Montague]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

4- If they have photoshopped their username and date into the photo from another thread, chances are it's a scam.

[the_monkey]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

1- If its too good to be true it is
2- If the seller has just joined, has no feedback and the first thing they are selling is a £400 gun...chances are its a scam
3- If it reffers to the product as a BB gun....chances are its a scam

[Desert.Express]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Zero in wont start verifying paypal emails for us, they have enough to do already and probably dont want to get involved with private sales, I can see it now, "but but its zero in's fault because they said the email was ok"

If the account is verified by Paypal and Zeroin too, this means that you're dealing with someone who should be 90% genuine.

And if he's not, you just send him money non-gifted; you'll always be on the safe spot. (till you buy material goods; because if you buy, for example, a code to get "Microsoft Points", it's not material and Paypal protection doesn't cover it)

What stops someone setting up a paypal address with no address and then coming here and setting up an account. Paypal do not want our custom to buy and sell RIF's privately so they will not be helping us track down peoples bank details if/when transactions go south.

Or have I missed something?

If an account is 100% verified by Paypal, this means they have your ID so a full name, birthdate and address too.

Not saying that Paypal has to forward this info to Zeroin, but at least Zeroin knows that a verified account correspond to someone with a name and an address.

Also, Paypal doesn't want us to buy/sell Rif's but when I told them I do this they were fine about it; it's not that clear if they want or not.

Not to mention that a Paypal account is closed when there are too many claims/disputes which involve the owner, and this is helpful if someone who has already tried to scam elsewhere comes here; a few more claims and he gets banned from Paypal (and here).

I've just noticed an influx of new members that have photoshopped their name / date into the image of what they're selling, has anyone else noticed this?

True, but mods do not seem to care; anytime I have to put for sale any single, stupid item I take paper and a pen, write my name and take the pics (even if I use the same "background" very often, it's noticeable in many pics, so I could use some took without the forum name and date, but I bother myself still as it's a rule at all effects and I have to respect it).

If you introduce a good rule but don't make people 100% respect it, it can't be considered all the way effective.

Bottom line is you'll never stop it, there will always be someone who circumvents the rules and those who see something that's too good to be true and still pays for it, if you're stupid enough to not do any research on a member then who's fault is it?

So that's why we need more uncompromising rules for sellers, on hand, and "teaching" people how to buy safely, on the other.

I think the research would not bring any result, as anyone can subscribe on 100 different forums with 100 names.

But, for example, the Paypal account is unique for any person, you put your real name and need to give the proof of it.

i would prefer id verification on account before post are allowed in classifieds, driving license scanned or passport and held by mods. Its easy set up to add to forum and only seen by mods

This would be more complicated, the best we could demand to Zeroin is to ask new member's real name when they subscribe, then the Paypal account to see if they match.

But I don't even know if they can, the Paypal account itself should be more than enough.

[ukpred]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

i would prefer id verification on account before post are allowed in classifieds, driving license scanned or passport and held by mods. Its easy set up to add to forum and only seen by mods

[Spatch69]

Re: How to stop scamming? Try this

Bottom line is you'll never stop it, there will always be someone who circumvents the rules and those who see something that's too good to be true and still pays for it, if you're stupid enough to not do any research on a member then who's fault is it?