Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

[tisane]

Simple one but I haven't got the slightest idea of the answer.

It's bugging the living crap out of me that I can't get hold of an Airsoft Vltor MUR upper, specifically a GBB version to finish off my Diplomat project.
To that end I'm seriously considering grabbing a RS one and having it modified to work with my WE.
Obviously it's not available in the UK so it would be a case of finding a US seller that would post or when my sis travels to the US later this year giving her the cash to purchase one while she is over there.

So would I be in any trouble importing, or would my sis be in any trouble bringing it back on a commercial flight?
And even if I can get it into the country is it 100% legal to actually own it?

Cheers in advance
Lee

[FPSEngland]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

I think, and don't quote me here, any firearms shop can order it in (As they have a proxy section 5 FAC) and then deactivate what can be used to fire a live round. Or modify it in your case to suit airsoft before handing it over.

[TriggerHappy]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Would think it would be way, way easier to modify an airsoft AEG MUR upper, and they're sold all over the place. Hell, for the price you would probably pay you could get it professionally tooled.

[pacey]

If im right in thinking, the uk and us laws are back to front on this. One classes the receiver as the firearm and the other doesn't. The big problem either way is getting something out of the US as it will be ITAR restricted. Like me just trying to get a RS scope mount for my real M14 your going to have ti get a local gun shop make a request to export from the US state department. It's long winded and costly, really not worth it for Airsoft.

[Armourpiercing]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Another issue is that if you have a part direct from the factory that has never been used on a firearm then chances are better that it could be deemed legal but should it be taken off of a firearm or even a deactivated firearm then you would be in on the wrong side of legal.
There are other more complexes than that, that is a very brief comment on one of the many parts of the laws regarding the matter. It isn't matching to any particulars, just a generalisation.
AP.

[tisane]

Would think it would be way, way easier to modify an airsoft AEG MUR upper, and they're sold all over the place. Hell, for the price you would probably pay you could get it professionally tooled.

That unfortunately isn't an option as due to the gearbox being in the way the AEG version has no hole in the rear of the receiver for the securing pin that GBBRs use to secure the rear of the receiver

[jimbob1254]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

I was also wondering this as for some reason a real VLTOR MUR upper costs less than one made for my CTW?

[pacey]

Real vs Airsoft is all down to supply and demand, in this case demand is greater for the real thing than Airsoft, hence th lower price. I often find it quite funny when I see a systema über maxed super shooty rifle for the same cost a real M4 dripping with genuine magpie and eotec red dots.

[TOBI]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Illegal to be owned without a FAC, as a pressure bearing part it's an "on ticket" item just like flashhiders, Muzzle breaks, suppressors etc, this is backed up by the judgements of R v Clarke and R v Ashton.

[Heinz]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

TOBI is 99% of the way there. Muzzle brakes, however, do not have to be on ticket, though flash hiders do - Section 57, 1968 Firearms Act. Frankly, this issue is something thats been really getting on my tits in the last six months, as when a certain retailer (whose actively advertising the fitment of certain real-steel components on both Facebook and his Website) finally feels the long arm of the law tugging on his collar, it will paint Airsoft in a very bad light.

As to FPSEngland's comment, sadly, thats incorrect in the eyes of the law. An item manufactured as a Sec 1 or Sec 5 part still retains that legal clasification even if modified. This is the reason that straight pull centre-fire AR15s in the UK have to be built new from the ground up - as a straight pull bolt action - instead of being converted from semi-auto AR-15s

For reading, if you're interested:

"component parts". R v Clarke (F), 82 Cr App R 308, CA states that the component part of a prohibited weapon is itself a prohibited weapon. Although there is no statutory definition, the Home Office Guidance to the Police at paragraph 13.70 states the following:

The term "component part" may be held to include (i) the barrel, chamber, cylinder, (ii) frame, body or receiver, (iii) breech, block, bolt or other mechanism for containing the charge at the rear of the chamber (iv), any other part of the firearm upon which the pressure caused by firing the weapon impinges directly. Magazines, sights and furniture are not considered component parts.

R v Ashton, CA, 1 February 2007 seems to suggest that any part that stops the weapon functioning as it was designed would be a component part:

"Whether in fact this particular gas plug is a component part of a prohibited weapon, is a matter of fact for the court to decide the words have their ordinary natural meaning. as a matter of reasonable interpretation it means a part that is manufactured to the purpose screw or washer, would not be a component part for present purposes. Similarly, a component part must be a part that if it were removed, the Gun could not function without it."

[TOBI]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Hmm,

I feel an order for a Battlecomp break coming along.....

damn just realised that a Battlecomp doesn't count as a break.

looks like I'll have to settle for a AAC 51T

[Heinz]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Sadly, the AAC 51T Brakeout is a combined muzzle brake and flash hider

[JohnC86]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Before I discovered airsoft I was very much into Air Rifle Target Shooting, and this particular subject is something i looked into, as it's possible to get an Air Pellet Conversion for a RS AR15 Lower.

However the legal grey area just seemed a bit risky to me, after many hours of research I decided the best idea would probably be to get one made.

The blueprints for AR15 are actually available for free. I wont directly link the page but this wiki article is informative: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_Distributed

It would just take someone with a little know-how with 3d design to edit this blueprint so it could accommodate an airsoft gearbox and parts.

From this I planned on doing two things, both of which involved my local 'Maker Group' (DIY technology group, we meet two or three times a month to experiment and do cool projects!). My local Maker Group (Liverpool) has both a 3d printer and a CNC machine. I planned to use the 3d printer to 'test' each design, as it's relatively low cost. Then once I was happy I had hoped to find a good piece of steel and CNC it.

That's my plan anyway, I've not put it into action yet as I'm still learning about airsoft and what all the internal parts do. Probably a lot more hassle than you were expecting but it could be a fun project for someone!

edit: by removing the RS internals and leaving a space for a gearbox it would no longer be classed as a Real Lower Receiver, but as I say it's a legal grey area, 3d printing of guns it's a big deal at the moment as the govt haven't worked out the laws properly yet other than saying it's a no-no. So if you decide to do something like this please take care and be sensible

[TriggerHappy]

Re: Are RS uppers legal to own in the UK?

Sadly, the AAC 51T Brakeout is a combined muzzle brake and flash hider

So the Magpul PTS ones which are made out of steel are legal or not? because they could definitely take pressure, and you can definitely buy them over here..

[pacey]

No because PTS is for training only and not designed for live fire, they deliberately make PTS lower quality too that end. I certainly would not use anything not designed for RS that is a pressure or load bare part.