TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

[StargateP90]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

PM Heroshark, hes on here I think. Hes the one that did it all!

Against shell ejectors too, unless you have one built by Schapp which seems to be flawless, though most of its custom made..

I had massive over hop as well, switched to 0.30gs after it wore in it was perfect. My KWA rubber just swelled to hell after about 1K through. Falcon is still going stock, also nice that I can hop .43gs easily :D

Managed to get my self a Marushin with broken arms for £50!

[sparrowhawk]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

if you want an affordable,reliable gbb rifle,then check out the new G&Gs, also they can be converted to aeg,by swapping out the internals and sticking a v2 gb

[PureSilver]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

CQB guns are the best guns to buy GBB, because you can have all of GBB's advantages - instant trigger response, intimidating noise, and above all fun to shoot - and yet not suffer from most of the GBB disadvantages, most of which are felt at long range (not a problem for CQB), outside in the cold (again, not a problem for CQB), or at high rates of fire (again, not a problem for CQB if you go somewhere sensible). GBB guns make so much sense for CQB that I'm not even going to suggest an AEG alternative. I'm ignoring the full-size assault rifles (like the otherwise very competent GBBR AR-15s) because really, what's the point of dragging something that big into a fight conducted at five meters' range? In roughly ascending order of size;

	Advantages	Disadvantages
Maruzen CZ Škorpion	Very, very small, with a high rate of fire and distinctive Eastern Bloc looks	Possibly too small, wire folding stock is clumsy and the looks are definitely Marmite. Not internally very strong (quite happy on lower powered gas, but avoid propane). Spares may be hard to come by, and the gun has no hardpoints for attaching useful accessories like a laser, sight or suppressor.
KSC B&T MP9	Very compact, with a nice folding stock and full trademarks. Very high rate of fire and large magazines combine for excellent performance. Been on sale for a while now, so problems largely identified if not completely resolved. Spares are available, the gun is happy on propane, is fearsomely loud, and comes with Picatinny rails for the attachment of accessories. The one to get is the new System 7 version with the fixed foregrip, which was designed by Steyr at the perfect angle. The gun is compatible with RS accessories - including B&T's holster - which points to it being 1:1.	The fundamental weak point is the disconnector, and if that breaks, the gun is out of action until a new one is bought. Magazines are not cheap by any stretch of the imagination, and you have to be careful to buy the newer ones (though they're easily distinguished). Spares, while available, usually have to be ordered from overseas. The stock is a side-folder, which can wobble unless shimmed slightly.
KSC H&K MP7	A very solid performer, the original GBB MP7 has a good compromise between size and performance. The most modern RS design barring the Kriss, the gun has been around for ages so most of its weakpoints have already been identified.	The gun isn't a 1:1 replica (it's about 8-10% too small). It doesn't seem to be much of a problem, but photos of it next to the real thing are rather jarring. You have to choose between a KSC version (that may need internal modification to undo limitations for the JDM) and a Umarex version that has paragraphs of trademark information etched into it.
TM H&K MP7	Built by the makers of the most reliable GBB pistols on the planet, and nicely featured with some trademarks (though also some TM trades). Performance on low-powered gas is excellent.	Like the earlier KSC version, for some reason this gun is simply too small. It's a new release, so aftermarket support is nonexistent. OEM support is, as usual for TM, very poor. Early examples have suffered internal failures with propane.
AABB Hera Arms/GLOCK Carbine	Probably the cheapest of all the options, the HERA is a completely reversible carbine upgrade for TM or KSC pattern GLOCKs. It is much, much more effective than just using the pistol alone, particularly with select-fire variants, and can mount all the accessories usually denied to pistol shooters. You can use the same magazines in your primary and your secondary. It is configurable for truly ambidextrous operation.	The HERA can be ordered either for TM or KSC GLOCKS - no kit fits both. The carbine itself is quite a crude design - a big plastic plank - and it is not adjustable for LOP unlike the stocks of the MP7. The HERA requires some fairly significant modification to work with select-fire GLOCKS, or some modification to the pistol itself and less severe modification to the HERA.
GHK/WE KAC PDW	The GHK is a very solid GBBR, now fitted with adjustable hop-up to address the previous weakpoint of the gun. With full trademarks and WA-compatible magazines, this is halfway between a CQB SMG and a full assault rifle. The gun has a side-folding stock to reduce its length, and is an easy exchange for AR-15 shooters. The WE is cheaper, but has no trademarks, an inferior finish (paint, rather than anodizing) and uses WE-pattern magazines. It's still very effective, particularly if you already own a WE GBBR. The design of the KAC is, almost uniquely amongst AR-15s, completely ambidextrous.	The PDW is by far the biggest gun here, and arguably is more of an assault rifle than CQB gun. The STANAGs (particularly the WA-pattern ones, like the ProWin V2s) are very nice but very expensive - over £60 a magazine. The WE's are cheaper but are of substantially lower quality.

There are a few options that you definitely shouldn't buy, no matter how tempting they look. The Tanio Koba H&K VP70 looks brilliant but is very fragile and finicky. The VFC H&K MP5 is likewise almost impossible to get running right, very finicky when you do, and parts support is very poor. The ACM (usually Well) MP5Ks are better, but suffer from the very small gas reservoirs in their tiny magazines and typical ACM build quality. With a PDW stock, the MP5K should be brilliant but in practice they're nowhere near as good as the MP7s. The Guarder/RA-Tech (née KWC) Mini Uzi is grotesquely overpowered for CQB, and it's hard to find select-fire versions new. The KWA Kriss is still not on sale and every update makes the prognosis worse, including the inexplicable decision to force a new magazine on buyers when the RS uses Glock magazines. The internal design of the Vector, whilst admirably recreating the RS, is designed to reduce recoil - which is half the fun of GBBs.

tl;dr: Buy a KSC MP9/MP7, or wait a few months, and buy a TM MP7.

[dave38x]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

The reason the vector uses new mags probably has something to do with the fact that airsoft glock mags are 9mm based, and the vector is .45acp. .45acp glocks are twice* as wide as 9mm glocks - they probably felt the need to make the mags accurately dimensioned for that gun

If it did actually take glock mags I'd buy one in a flash... got plenty of glock mags lying about!

*slight overstatement, but not much

[Thunderfury]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

I'm sold on the GHK PDW , i love the pdw and i have a bunch of wa mags spare.

[Apurturesci]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

The reason the vector uses new mags probably has something to do with the fact that airsoft glock mags are 9mm based, and the vector is .45acp. .45acp glocks are twice* as wide as 9mm glocks - they probably felt the need to make the mags accurately dimensioned for that gun

If it did actually take glock mags I'd buy one in a flash... got plenty of glock mags lying about!

*slight overstatement, but not much

About time someone made a Glock 21 anyway! KWA might as well and they'd share the TDI Vector mags.

[sparrowhawk]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

hey josh what about the Mac 10s and 11s?

[dave38x]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

ApertureSci - all it would take would be someone to produce a frame, slide and barrel that ran vector mags and you'd be set! Just transplant over everything from your regular glock!

[FireKnife]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

You do know that the Kriss has a 9mm version too? Well it is the K10 but still.

So why they could not have based it on that and then retained the usual 9mm mags is beyond me.

And anyway, why not just make the insides of the magwell thicker or shorter to hold and operate on a 9mm mag, it is still firing 6mm bbs and once the mag is in the gun it wouldn't make a difference.

Seems like an oversight on the part of KWA.

'FireKnife'

[Black Templar]

Or a cunning plan to make more money?
Think it will sell by the small hatch-back load and hopefully go as well as it looks.

[StargateP90]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

I wouldnt bother with MACs. To higher ROF v.s Mag Cap and range and accuracy is shoddy at best. Want somthing small like that get an MP9

Forgot about the Hera Kits. A TM G17 - Or modded for an 18C would be very very good, even toyed with getting one myself.

[PureSilver]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

hey josh what about the Mac 10s and 11s?

I was afraid of writing not just one novel, but a series - plus I don't know very much about them. Fill us in! Are they any good?

[EDIT]Also, thinking about it, if the PDW counts, really we should include the GHK AKS-74U, which is a great gun that's about the same size...[/EDIT]

[sparrowhawk]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

they are as mad as a box of frogs....like all these types of guns good for cqb.....my favourite is the classic Tec9

[FireKnife]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

Firing a MAC-11 is like a guy with premature ejaculation having sex with a stunning and filthy woman.

So much win but over way to quickly.

Still I think that KWA are just being a it money grabbing while missing the big picture. If you sell a Kriss with a 9mm Glock mag then people will be inclined to buy the Glock to go with it for games and then you will have a win-win situation.

'FireKnife'

[rouge]

Re: TM mp7 GBB or Kriss Vector?

i dont see the mp7 not taking propane as to much a problem!! as it will run fine on standard gas and that hop will make the rounds fly forever.
propane is cheaper though i guess especially with the propane converter
if you want something really special have you considered an ebb from tm pro-line?