Ares Electronic Firing Control System

[ThePope]

Directly ripped from Popular Airsoft.... (Not sure what the hell to make of this as well it's Ares but brushless motors really intrigues me.)



While it seems that most of the energy for airsoft innovation is being devoted to gas blowback in the recent years, we thought that the AEG has already reached the pinnacle of innovation with the recoil and blowback series that were introduced by Tokyo Marui and followed by a few others. Others have decided that the AEG rather than follow the leader as usual, be further enhanced by improving the efficiency and configurability through firing control units such as the use of MOSFETs.

Ares Airsoft is in this camp. They just recently announced their Next Generation Firing Control System that is first installed in their M4 Series then to be followed by the G36 and TAR21 series. I have to admit that when writing this story, I am still confused with this system as I see in one poster a control box for the Firing Control System, and in another poster the M4 Series that don't show the control box but announce the same features as in the first poster.





So many of us will be confused if this is a new innovation in gearbox technology as "there are no moving parts" which means that our issues about stripped gears will soon be a thing of the past. One commented on Facebook Page if this system uses the same thing in RC Toys, the use of brushless motor to power model planes. We are not sure about it though until we get to see an actual demo and a walkthrough of this new system. And the control box is a configuration system that the airsoft player can use to tweak the AEG.

But just like the MOSFETs we see in the Control Box that it will be easier to configure the AEG to such as adjusting the firing modes which we do it with the trigger with the add-on MOSFETs in the airsoft market, now just turn the knob. It will also be more power efficient as it will be able to maximize power usage when the type of battery is also inputted into the memory. It can operate from 6.0v to 15v ones, making it a powerful one.

Will it be a game changer? We don't know, but this design puts Ares Airsoft on the other side of the camp in terms of AEG technology, together with ICS and Systema Engineering more focused on the electronic side of things. On the opposing side are two formidable companies: Tokyo Marui and KWA, the latter with their ERG (Electric Recoil Gun), and a new brand, Bolt Airsoft, which see improvements in the AEG mechanically such as better blowback, better recoil, firing operations like a real steel firearm or a gas blowback rifle rather than add more electronic gizmos to it to provide more realism which a good number of airsoft players demand.

As the implications for us airsoft players, we say bring them on! We love innovations in airsoft to enhance our playing and "realism" experience. At the end of the day it is us airsoft players who will vote with our money as to what innovation we will like better.

[crasstoe]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

I imagine this is either the same unit on the Ares Beryl, in a fancy case, or they haven't got a final mock up yet and are playing with which look to go for.

I see this eventually filtering to all ARES aegs, whether they license it to others is another thing entirely.

[No1_sonuk]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

I don't see how a brushless motor can work all that well in airsoft - They tend to need to be running continuously to work properly.

As for the magnetic sensors: Some hobbyists have already done that, including at least 1 who replaced the whole ver2 trigger switch assembly with a MOSFET controller that included the hall effect sensor and selector switches.
In that case, he put a magnet in the sector gear to detect its position when it had released the piston.

[Hunter512]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

So ares are finally attempting to come up with decent internals then?

[seansamurai1]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

I don't see how a brushless motor can work all that well in airsoft - They tend to need to be running continuously to work properly.

As for the magnetic sensors: Some hobbyists have already done that, including at least 1 who replaced the whole ver2 trigger switch assembly with a MOSFET controller that included the hall effect sensor and selector switches.
In that case, he put a magnet in the sector gear to detect its position when it had released the piston.

A brushless motor has more torque, more speed and very much likes start stop. (otherwise RC cars wouldnt be using them).
It just requires a good ESC to do it.

[dave38x]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

ESC?

Wasnt there a guy a while back who fitted a brushless motor to a gun?

No moving parts is a misnomer - it clearly has a nozzle that must retract, and it clearly has shafts for gears. And it clearly requires a motor. I think perhaps they mean "no moving parts in the trigger system, just straight electronics"...

[ScoobySnacks]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

ESC, Electronic Speed Controller.

[ThePope]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

ESC?

Wasnt there a guy a while back who fitted a brushless motor to a gun?

No moving parts is a misnomer - it clearly has a nozzle that must retract, and it clearly has shafts for gears. And it clearly requires a motor. I think perhaps they mean "no moving parts in the trigger system, just straight electronics"...

More like the "unit" to change to burst etc.

[Hawk]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

I saw this today as well. Will most definitely be keeping my eye on this to see how it develops

[No1_sonuk]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

A brushless motor has more torque, more speed and very much likes start stop. (otherwise RC cars wouldnt be using them).
It just requires a good ESC to do it.

RC cars don't run their motors for a fraction of a second.
How many revolutions does an RC car motor do between start and stop? 16?
An AEG with 16:1 gears on semi-auto needs the motor to run reliably for only 16 revolutions. Maybe 1 or 2 more before the cutoff, but not nearly close to RC car start/stop times.

Back-EMF sensing in the ESC isn't reliable enough, or even accurate enough for that short a run. It'd have to be a motor with sensors.
RC cars get away with it because it doesn't matter if the drive sequence is out of sync to begin with.

[badger906]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

well you can get sensor and sensorless brushless motors. Meaning a sensored motor tells the esc exactly where its rotor is at any given time.

In the rc world the main difference is the smoothness of the acceleration. Sensorless motors tend to judder at the start, as the power wont be applied until the rotor is at a specific point, so would easily rule that out for an airsoft gun.

[the_monkey]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

as my previous job as an installer of those scary metal boxes of death we all call lifts, we used to install something called VVF motors, Variable voltage variable frequency. these motors ran at full tourque regardless of theirs speed, they used a device to work out the position of the motor exactly and varied the voltage and frequency to make the motor judder thousands of times a second to create the force required to lift said scary metal box of death. brilliant idea, but huge and horrifically expensive. If im guessing i think ares will have installed a version of this on their new gun. the up shot being that while there will be no more gears etc the price may be horrific. however, is that a reasonable exchange for reliability and program ability? ust ashame they decided to put it all in an M4..why not something new and bizzare instead of another m4 with cool bits on it...

[No1_sonuk]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

well you can get sensor and sensorless brushless motors. Meaning a sensored motor tells the esc exactly where its rotor is at any given time.

In the rc world the main difference is the smoothness of the acceleration. Sensorless motors tend to judder at the start, as the power wont be applied until the rotor is at a specific point, so would easily rule that out for an airsoft gun.

Exactly my point.

[MajorLandmark]

Re: Ares Electronic Firing Control System

Just wondering, where is the discussion of brush-less motors coming from? The advert doesn't mention them at all, and we've established that a magnet on the sector gear is a suitable method for controlling the cycle.

To me, that advert seems to be introducing a fancy fet that replaces all of the trigger parts with its own and nothing more. The gearbox shell clearly has bearings for gears, so it presumably doesn't do anything cool like have a motor driving the piston it directly or with fewer gears which leaves you with just a fet in a normal-ish gearbox modded to fit it, along with the required sensors for cycle control.

Still pretty cool to see a gun with a fire mode selectable highly featured fet out the box though. Definitely a step forward.