First man in room clearing?

[dave38x]

Of course I would pick people off from outside first on approach lol, I'm not a numpty :P

If your stacked on a room that you can't see into then that is useless, and the quickest method is tossing a bang into the room before you breach, anything else will result in you getting hit, repeatedly :P

Sent from outer space

[dj2l8b]

Wouldnt it be more wise to chuck a nade in the room first then go after it!
If you just go like that..you will be in major pain!

[Boo-Sabum Ben]

Still, thought it shoul be pointed out. Everyone's approach seems to be get in there then figure out what's in there and what to do about it!

[FCS]

Best method I've ever used was sheer accidental...

Wandered up a corridor, struck a thermobaric and threw it into the room. Didn't hear a bang for ages.... But it soon had 4 of the enemy team walking out - soon for me to realise I'd struck a dual vent orange Enola Gaye smoke instead (dark corridors - don't ask!)

Basically choked them out... Worked well though! Haha!

[seansamurai1]

Re: First man in room clearing?

Still, thought it shoul be pointed out. Everyone's approach seems to be get in there then figure out what's in there and what to do about it!

That's the nature of CQB, its also the reason why proper drills are set the way they are. Each person only has a small area to worry about.

[headshotso19]

Re: First man in room clearing?

That's the nature of CQB, its also the reason why proper drills are set the way they are. Each person only has a small area to worry about.

Bah humbug call an airstrike

[seansamurai1]

Re: First man in room clearing?

Leeeeeeeroooyyyy jenkiiiiins!
:dd

[Mikep81]

Re: First man in room clearing?

Just a quick question, but apart from the immediate entry of doorway, what corner and side is the first man in a stack responsible to clear? So many conflicting sources say one or the other. Naturally its not always predetermined but is their any rule of thumb to follow for the first mans responsibility? Cheers.

There's so many conflicting sources because to be honest there is no "best way" to do it. There are multiple way's to get you killed quicker but there are also multiple ways to get the job done safer. I have recevied SWAT training and was taught that number 1 (the first guy) turns the direction of his weak side. So a right handed shooter would go left, and a left handed shooter would go right. Obviously this is all decided and practised before hand. So with a right handed shooter making the entry number 1 enters, sweeps straight ahead and round to the left while number 2 enters, muzzle over right shoulder of number one, and sweeps ahead and to the right followed by the rest of the team who stagger, stepping left and right from the doorway. The downside to this tactic is that if you have a lefty on point then number 2 would need to be a lefty too so that he could cover over the shoulder. When entering the room you only go as far as the first corner and never turn back on yourself to avoid crossfire with your own blokes. You also, NEVER step away from the wall until the room is declared clear, otherwise you'll end up with a blue on blue. And always grenade or flash bang a room before hand if they're available.

Rates of fire is a debatable one and maybe something that Reaper Leaper can confirm. From a military point of view, I've always been taught, if taking a room in Attack Red, you go in on full auto, is this still the case? From a civvie point of view in terms of a SWAT scenario, you go in on semi. This is just what I have been taught though and other organisations/trainers will teach different. Combat and small team tactics are very fluid situation where things can change in the blink of an eye.

In airsoft I clear rooms on full auto, unless the site bans full auto in buildings!

If I can put my two pennies' in - I am a Army OBUA instructor and although we don't do this stuff to SF levels every day I think I'm in position to offer some advice.
The initial entry method into a room depends on unit SOP's, the tactical situation and the first man's decision taking in all the factors. The button hook method (i.e. the entry man doubling round into the blind spot) is favoured as the number 2 is right behind and will follow the wall the team can 'see' from the door, leaving the room covered very quickly.
The cross over method is another method used, although it has two people entering the doorway (and the fatal funnel of fire) very closely together with no cover to the front.
There are other techniques but it's very hard to explain in this medium! Some of the best entry drills in a film recently are, in my opinion, the ones in Zero Dark Thirty, particularly the slow approach work followed by short, sharp entry - you should always look for the three S's - Surprise, Speed and Shock
In all honesty, unless you have trained with you teammates to a VERY high degree and trust each other implicitly you can't really do effective 2, 3 and 4 man room entry drills, best chuck a grenade in and follow it as soon as it goes off!

This is an excellent point. It takes hours and hours of muscle memory build up to get to the required standard. That being said, because of the way airsoft is played and the limitations of the kit used, it's very hard to do proper room clearance anyway!

[ElZer0]

Re: First man in room clearing?

First man goes left, Second man goes right, third straight ahead, 4th covers the entracnce you just come in. (crazy the amount of people who dont watch there back)

Third man is also icharge of getting hostages, intel, pressing a button (imagining its a game where you have to press a button to win) etc etc

[Hawke]

Re: First man in room clearing?

In airsoft, there is no set drill, unless you practise, practise, practise. The harsh reality is that we don't have the time or the opportunity to do so, what with having real life and stuff to get on with. So the best thing to do is get yourself in a huddle, give each player a role and make sure you and they stick with it.
However, as the old adage goes, no plan survives the first shot. It's a case of trial and error. Say if we all agree that as a set drill Man 1 goes left, Man2 goes right - well, all the room's original occupiers have to do is anticipate that each time, and the room entry team faces the walk back to regen.
Mix it up a little, don't be predictable.

[messy]

Re: First man in room clearing?

im usually the first man in and i dont stick to one or the other - i do what ever is appropriate for the situation - if i know there's a guy in the left corner ill go left and try and get him, if i have no clue if there are people there ill go for the wall opposite the side of the door im entering from as it lets me clear the door fastest (rather than having to stop just inside, pivot in the opposite direction and then start moving again).

etc

[Bobovan]

Re: First man in room clearing?

not an amazingly professional tactic, bit i've seen it work wonders, one mat holds a torch high in the doorway while his buddy either crouches low or lies down and takes aimed shots at anyone shooting at the torch...probably not as effective as any of the other suggestions, but a lot easier to organise/practice without hours and hours of training.

alternatively run into the room spinning round with your minigun

[Mikep81]

Re: First man in room clearing?

not an amazingly professional tactic, bit i've seen it work wonders, one mat holds a torch high in the doorway while his buddy either crouches low or lies down and takes aimed shots at anyone shooting at the torch...probably not as effective as any of the other suggestions, but a lot easier to organise/practice without hours and hours of training.

alternatively run into the room spinning round with your minigun

You say not a professional tactic but that is taught for pistol drills and a method that I would use. Always hold your torch at arms length and fire one handed! Great tactic!!

[Stealthkiller]

Re: First man in room clearing?

The first man In is usually pushed in and still has a foot mark on his arse from the other team members behind fed up of waiting for him to make a decision !

[reaper_leaper]

Re: First man in room clearing?

Rates of fire is a debatable one and maybe something that Reaper Leaper can confirm. From a military point of view, I've always been taught, if taking a room in Attack Red, you go in on full auto, is this still the case? From a civvie point of view in terms of a SWAT scenario, you go in on semi. This is just what I have been taught though and other organisations/trainers will teach different. Combat and small team tactics are very fluid situation where things can change in the blink of an eye.

In airsoft I clear rooms on full auto, unless the site bans full auto in buildings!

Sorry for the horrendously late reply, but to answer your question above - current doctrine has changed from using the 'fun setting' fire selector to single shot throughout. Operational experience was finding that fully automatic fire was running the risk of civilian casualties, leading to friendly fire (stray rounds going through partition walls etc) and massively increasing the amount of rounds troops needed to carry compared to conventional equipment scales. Also, double tapping people is seen as a more lethal shot - aimed shots and all that jazz.
Personally, I agree with the decision for all the reasons above and more - namely that in a high stress, high adrenaline environment it gives you another way to control excitable and pumped up troops.
For Airsoft, I'd encourage single shot and mid caps in a urban environment at all times. It avoids overkill, makes players more willing to move through the terrain instead of hiding in corners with box mags, and is also probably the closest you will get to realistic military training in the sport. For me, Airsoft isn't just a game (although it is and bloody good fun too!), it's a legitimate (if unrecognised in the British Army) way to train realistically.