Taclights: Strobe or not?

[StargateP90]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

Thats hard to check and regulate though

On my phone, my spelling will suck.

[Another]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

People just dont like it because the feel it gives an unfair advantage. Which it does, its a tactic. My strobe is a Sig STL 900 160 lumens strobes around 80 - 120 times per second i believe (cant quite remember) that is pretty disracting and some what blinding when running through a dark CQB hallway. Causes the other person to panic for a split second allowing me to get my rounds off slightly quicker than them. That said its always on my pistol/rifle and never left in a hallway shineing down constantly.

Anything that gives you the edge or advantage is fine.

An interesting point of view. Its becoming harder to buy a taclight without a strobe function and many of mine have it. Though I choose never to use that function because I dislike strobing.

Oddly, I seemed to do just fine without that extra edge.

[Hawaiian Special Forces]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

I know what it is to have dizzy spells and fits set off by strobers, little makes me despise an airsofter more than one who puts their own competitive advantage over someone else's health.

I tend to make clear to anyone playing that I have this problem, trouble starts when people disregard it.

[theagitater]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

I've got a mate who has epilepsy and it's not just flashing lights that can set it off.

Yellow or Orange tints – Improve contrast and give a sensation of heightened visual acuity. Lenses in these hues block haze and blue light and enhance the orange color of the target. The brighter yellow the lens color is, the better it is for use during low-light conditions.

I myself use yellow and orange lenses, after a few minutes of wearing them you eyes adjust and you don't really notice the yellow, when you take them off everything looks quite blue for a sec or two.

As for strobes, been on the wrong end of them and didn't like it, but also been on the wrong end of a m249 and didn't like that lol.

Are you saying that we should only play in day light incase anyone runs into something or someone uses a strobe, Marshall's should carry hoovers to suck up the bbs incase someone slips, camo bubble wrap suits for everyone!

I get headaches from being on the losing team and being shot, should no one shoot me and let me win?

Playing airsoft comes with some risk of injury.

- - - Updated - - -

Just to clarify strobes - yes if not spammed

And on a serious note if someone had genuine epilepsy I'd have no problem with them not being used, as for oh it gives me a headache then just deal with it.

[Hawaiian Special Forces]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

And on a serious note if someone had genuine epilepsy I'd have no problem with them not being used,

As opposed to fake epilepsy?

[theagitater]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

As opposed to fake epilepsy?

No as opposed to people sensitive to light ie headaches etc.

[steve grey]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

I'm quite a sympathetic person, I hope, in most aspects of life, and will more often than not, go out of my way to accommodate people with any particular problems, but when it comes to sports and hobbies, which you "choose" to take part in, you should select the ones that suit you best, not expect others to bend their rules and style of play to suit you, if you've got arthritic knees, don't play football, if you've got a slipped disc, give weightlifting a miss and if strobes affect you, just play day games....

[Hawaiian Special Forces]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

Why should someone affected by strobe lights be effectively barred from CQB play because strobers refuse to not use one of their toys? Surely it harms no one for you to have your flashy torch set to either on or off and not flashing constantly to get every possible hispeed competitive advantage (because people apparently clearly need it?)?

[BAMF]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

As opposed to fake epilepsy?

There is a condition known as "Pseudo epilepsy" (Non Epileptic Attack Disorder) which is related to stress and poor coping skills.

I have a tendency to agree with Steve Grey and theagitater also Seansamurai, that strobes can offer something of a tactical advantage. If players have a diagnosed condition and realise strobes may have an adverse effect on them, then maybe they shouldn't engage in an activity that could potentially exacerbate their condition.

Strobes are designed to disorientate and disrupt an opponent's night vision. If a person has an as yet, undiagnosed condition, that's unfortunate. What we do otherwise? Refuse to eat, drink or touch anything lest it give us a reaction? People are responsible for their own safety. If they know they may suffer an attack from exposure to strobe lighting, then avoid situations where they may be present.

Simple really.

[Fizzy]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

Why should someone affected by strobe lights be effectively barred from CQB play because strobers refuse to not use one of their toys? Surely it harms no one for you to have your flashy torch set to either on or off and not flashing constantly to get every possible hispeed competitive advantage (because people apparently clearly need it?)?

Perhaps we should also ban pyro in case someone has hearing problems? After all, why should someone with a hearing problem be excluded?

You could always speak to the guys running the site and see what they say about banning strobes, but if they choose not to, that's their choice.

[Patrolpointman]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

At the end of the day, common sense is the way forward. Unfortunately it is usually the first thing to get left behind. If you know you have an adverse reaction to light/noise then you should expect to encounter both in volume at a game. If these can be overcome with yellow tinted glasses and ear protection then you should employ these. If however, the problem is more severe then perhaps you shouldn't play airsoft as, even if every precaution is taken, accidents can still happen and it would be unfair to hamper everyone else who has paid for the day. You also run the risk of not being covered by site insurance if the problem is severe enough.

[Fenriz]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

At the end of the day, common sense is the way forward. Unfortunately it is usually the first thing to get left behind. If you know you have an adverse reaction to light/noise then you should expect to encounter both in volume at a game. If these can be overcome with yellow tinted glasses and ear protection then you should employ these. If however, the problem is more severe then perhaps you shouldn't play airsoft as, even if every precaution is taken, accidents can still happen and it would be unfair to hamper everyone else who has paid for the day. You also run the risk of not being covered by site insurance if the problem is severe enough.

Pretty much. Top show sir.

[Hawaiian Special Forces]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

Perhaps we should also ban pyro in case someone has hearing problems? After all, why should someone with a hearing problem be excluded?

You could always speak to the guys running the site and see what they say about banning strobes, but if they choose not to, that's their choice.

Fortunately I've never had one say no yet - all of the sites that I've been to in the last five years have responded well to my health concerns and barred the use of strobes at any game I've played in. Gameplay is essentially unchanged, you can still maintain light dominance with a light without high frequency sustained flashing - a world away from flashlight use - to deliberately dazzle. Site owners understand it's pretty dickish to turn someone away at the door because of a refusal to disallow strobes. They're not that big of a game changer for the danger they bring to someone like me.

I've occasionally had airsofters think they can use strobes anyway despite being very clearly told in briefings not to, quick word with a marshall has often sorted that.


Also I highly endorse ear protection for everyone. We protect our eyes and our face so our ears are a sensible thing to protect too. Howard Leight Impact Sports headsets are amazing and actually enhance your hearing while protecting it from loud bangs like pyro. The point is, I take precautions where I can, but there's nothing I can do to mitigate strobing except ask site owners to bar them for the sake of my health.

It's really not much to ask. If no one raises health problems WRT strobes to the marshalls on a gameday but actually has major physical reactions to them then that's on them - no way for site owners to know.

What I object to is the airsofters who whinge about having their toys disallowed.

[W0lf]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

I don't ever want to go to a site you attend...

[Smintheus]

Re: Taclights: Strobe or not?

I think there's a line to be drawn here.

On the one hand, if someone turned up at a CQB site with some hearing related problem which meant a loud bang would be extremely bad for them, it would be insane to ban all pyro for the day. (As well as un-economical. Sites make money from pyro sales.) Moreover, ear protection is readily and cheaply available.

However, I'm with Hawaiian. It's entirely reasonable to ban strobes because someone has photosensitive epilepsy. They're not critical to the game's flow, they're not owned or used by the majority of players, and epilepsy isn't something a person can do something about - you either have it, or you don't. I'm not convinced wearing yellow tinted lenses would prevent a high powered strobe torch from causing an epileptic attack. As for the "find another hobby", that just seems like discrimination to me. Considering it from a business standpoint, when there is an easy method by which a company can make allowances for customers with a disability, (banning strobes), I'm fairly sure ignoring that method and simply saying "Sorry, find another sport" would probably lead to a lawsuit. On top of that, it's just unpleasant, and not in any way the open and inclusive attitude I love finding in most airsofters.

And then you have to consider the nature of 3rd party liability insurance. Insurers are notoriously picky about every little thing. I wouldn't be surprised if the health and safety requirement of banning strobes in the event of photosensitive epilepsy is a condition of the insurance policy, much as the "safe" employment of BFGs is now on many sites.

EDIT : And, reading back through, yes. Banning for undiagnosed potential conditions is silly, banning because of "gameplay advantage" is silly, and I've never personally had a problem (I suffer from migraines, but not photo-triggered.) nor seen anyone have a problem .