Gas gun issues

[WeskerAlbert]

Today was my first time actually firing my gas blowback M9. I didnt expect there to be any issues. I've never used a gas powered gun before. Firstly i couldnt get the gas to go into the mag, it just sprayed out everywhere (i was doing it correctly as it says to) Looks so simple to do but it just wouldnt do it. When i eventually got enough in for a few shots i had a go at firing it. Now whether or not its loaded with bb's it doesnt fire correctly. Its a semi automatic pistol in which it should fire continually when i pull the trigger (the slide go back and forwards) but this is not happening. It makes the bang when i pull the trigger but the slide does not move. When i put bb's in it wont fire unless i cock the slide back for each shot, which i should not have to do. Also sometimes when i fire, gas seems to discharge from the front of the gun. I know none of these things should happen but im not sure what the problem is. My brother in law thought its because the bb's are too big or something, but they do fire out, just only if the slide is cocked. Whether or not the gun is loaded it doesnt fire with gas as its ment to, the slide doesnt move at all. That makes me think its not the bb's because they do fire ok. Something to do with the mag? but im not sure what. These are the bb's i bought: http://www.zerooneairsoft.com/produc...oducts_id=5047 and my gun is the one in my sig (Tokyo Marui GBB M92F) Didnt matter whether i used that gun or my clear M9, neither were working properly. I think the clear was actually better than my replica one though, when i fired that the slide did go back, it just kept sticking and stayed back. My other one didnt move at all though. Maybe just not enough gas in i have no idea. No matter what i did i couldnt get the gas to go into it properly. Looks and sounds so simple to do but i couldnt do it without it spraying out everywhere. I did get some in though as i fired several bb's (having to cock for each shot) so i dont know whats going on with it. Guess theres a technique to getting the seal with the gas into the magazine. What little i managed to get in still should have functioned the gun correctly though as it did with the clear one. I was using a can of green gas which came with my clear M9 which is this: http://bbgunsuk.co.uk/xcart/product....8&cat=0&page=1 Any ideas what the problem could be? I was sure i bought the right size and weight bb's and the gas i thought should be fine. I just dont know why its not firing right, comes out the front of the gun sometimes and when it does fire i have to cock each shot.. I didnt expect any problems as it seemed simple

[Stargazer]

Re: Gas gun issues

I assume u were holding the magazine upside down while trying to fill with gas? Also what temperature was it at because that gas should be plenty powerful enough...

Stargazer

[WeskerAlbert]

Re: Gas gun issues

Yes i was doing it exactly as you're ment to (both magazine and gas canister upside down and vertical) Temp im not sure.. whatever it was here today in NE Scotland. Wasnt cold anyway but not hot either, i'd guess around 10 degrees ish maybe a bit less. I was thinking about getting some 134a gas to try that as my slide is plastic not metal i thought that might be better to use. Green is all i have as it came with my clear gun

[Raguri]

Re: Gas gun issues

try it indoors. that temperature is very low! so the gas will not be as effective. if i were you, i would find the warmest part of your house, find something to shoot, and have a go

[LtPurcy]

Re: Gas gun issues

Theres several reasons why its spewing out everywhere.

1. even though you think youve positioned it, you havnt, some valves are very picky, move it around while filling till a point where it stops (if thats the case)

2. the valves arent screwed in properly or they have never been used and are so leaky you could drink off it, if thats the case soak them in oil over night or tighten them if they are loose.

hope i helped.

[WeskerAlbert]

Re: Gas gun issues

I tried firing inside too but was just the same. Was warm ish, not cold anyway. I tried moving it around a bit when i was putting it in, just must not be getting it exactly right whatever i did. Probably easy when you're used to doing it but as is my first time i just couldnt get it. I havent fired the mag before but when i got it last month it came with some gas in it. Not much but i fired off at the time what was in it. Think using 134a gas would make any difference with how it fires? Maybe the temp was an issue too. The amount of gas that wasnt going in resulted in the mag being freezing cold with the propane. Will order some 134a if it will make any difference. Should be better in the warmer weather. Just wasnt sure with when it was firing, why it had to be cocked each shot when it shouldnt have to and why gas was coming out of the front of the gun. Probably just need practice with the right way of getting the gas into the mag

[hoggy21]

Re: Gas gun issues

Probably easy when you're used to doing it but as is my first time i just couldnt get it

That's what she said!


Anyway, to answer the post...

With the magazine, the minor problem that sometimes occurs is that the gas when it is put into the mag is it cools due to the pressure. Try holding mag upside down, valve up in the air. When you fill it, depending on the mag, some of them will always vent a little gas. I had the TM M92F and it had a bit of leakage (excuse the pun) when filling. It will vent a little of the gas, but it should vent a lot of gas off when it is full. Once this is done, press the little button on the back of the mag. If its under a lot of pressure, then there is sufficient gas in the mag. Let the mag warm up (As said, the mag cools when filling). Then, without BB's loaded, put mag in gun. Cock it, holding down the release catch on the back. If the slide isnt going forward easily, then you might need to dsiassemble the gun and grease it up. Make sure the gun is clean, as if its new the packing grease can be dodgy.

Holding back the release catch, pull trigger a few times. If its going back and not returning to the start position, then it might be that the release catch is playing up. If it does go back, then forward again, but wont fire again, it sounds like the hammer and striker is playing up. Make sure the magazine is seated correctly, as if the hammer doesnt strike the gs pin on the back properly then that might be another problem.

134a gas is lower powered then green, so if its a cycling problem with the slide, a low power gas wont help.

Quick edit here - When filling the mag, make sure that the gas can to valve is flush. Dont go off the angle of the bottom of the mag, go off the valve itself. Due to the angle the valve is fitted into the mag, it may not be at the same angle as that of the bottom of the mag. I would try find a picture, but its pretty impossible.

Also, the less gas that is in the mag, the less action is in the slide. Be sure its as full as possible. If none of the above work, then send the gun back under its warrenty. Its fooked.

[hoggy21]

Re: Gas gun issues

Having re-read your OP, i think that if it still doesnt work after all the above, send the gun back. Sounds like the gas flow inlet (or whatever its called) isnt letting gas through. Basically, theres a part in the slide which lets some gas through to re-cock the gun. Some gas goes to force BB out, some goes into gun to re-cock it. It its firing but not re-cocking, it means gas is leaving the mag, but not getting up into the gun to re-cock the slide.
Anyway, best of luck mate.

[WeskerAlbert]

Re: Gas gun issues

lol

Yeah i maybe should have left it for a little while after putting the gas in. I just had no idea if there was actually any gas in it or not so i fired straight away to find out. Never got more than several shots before it ran out. Ment to get like 2 full mags worth per fill of gas. Saw it was recommended to fill for 3 seconds to fill the mag, which i was doing (and a few times 5+ seconds as before had gotten a few shots worth so thought longer would be better) but nothing seemed to get enough gas into the mag. Either its just not getting enough in to get the full power to work the slide or its a gun issue. Im sure the gun was fine when i fired it with the initial gas that came in the mag. I only got like 3 shots worth with it so i dont really remember but i think it was ok, i dont remember having to push the slide back into position anyway. I expected gas would start coming out when it was full to indicate that as theres no other way to tell when its full but even so i got only a few shots before the gas ran out and nothing was functioning as it should

Some lube might help it. Im using a different slide that came on the gun so the grease is on that slide not this one (i have the internals from my clear m9 inside my current one and the new ones in the slide that came on this gun) I ment to order some with the bb's but i forgot. Is on for my next order. Could be any of the problems you've mentioned, the release or the hammer. They seemed fine to me but i suppose it could be. What i could try is using the slide that came on the gun and see if that makes any difference, never thought of that at the time

I was pretty sure i had it at the right angle, probably just not getting the tight seal and the gas just flying out the sides instead. I'll keep trying it this week and see if i can learn it better and hopefully if i get it fully filled it might fix the issues i was getting with the slide. If not then i know its a gun issue

Thanks for the help


Ah that sounds possible.. its not re-cocking so either im not getting enough gas in to get it to do that or theres a problem with that. I'll try and get the mag fully filled and fire to see what happens. Hopefully more gas will correct it but if not i know theres a problem

[hoggy21]

Re: Gas gun issues

Try taking the top slide off, and when the mag is empty, put the mag in and fire it. If its hitting the gas release button on the back of the mag, then its not a problem with the hammer. Also, does the mag vent all its gas when the slide goes back and forth? If it vents it in one massive then its a problem with the slide/hammer. Basically, when you pull the trigger, the hammer strikes the back of the magazine (The little metal nub for releasing gas out the mag). If theres not enough gas to cycle the gun slide back, the hammer doesnt re-cock back, which means its still pressing down on the nub in the mag, releasing all the gas in one massive burst. It could mean a problem with the slide, or the mag not releasing gas into the right par of the gun, which cocks it back. Try stripping, cleaning, and re-lubing the slide and gun up, then take your time with the mag. If you cant tell i the mag is filling, and there is no venting from the mag, put your ear next the the can of gas. You'll hear what sounds like bubbles when its filling, which sound ease off and stop when the mag is full. Hard t describe how it sounds, but you'll know it when you hear it.

I keep missing parts of your post! - If its making the slide go back all the way, then its not a problem with the gun. If its not making the slide go back at all, then it more than likely is.

[WeskerAlbert]

Re: Gas gun issues

Ok will check that and see that it is actually hitting the release button. I'd assume it is if the slide did go back with gas, just didnt re-cock. It could be that, maybe just not enough gas in to get the slide to go back into position. I just need to learn how to do it properly. Sometimes with the slide in the starting position, when i pulled the trigger the slide didnt move, gas just came out of the front of the gun instead. I'll try with my other slide and see if that works correctly. If that does then i know its something with my slide thats causing it. Need to get the angle and seal right so i can actually get enough gas in to test it properly. Gas can is already down to like half after all that yesterday. No point getting 134a gas then will be even weaker in powering the slide. I'll see what i can do with it and keep trying the gas. Hopefully its just its not enough gas in and that will fix it. Being a new gun i'd hope nothing was wrong with it

[Stargazer]

Re: Gas gun issues

I assume this has no upgrades inside? because a more powerful recoil spring could again make it harder for the slide to go back fully causing it to not properly cock the next round/reset the hammer. When filling the mags take a close look at the valves and note whether they are at an angle, then gently push the gas can onto them until ur satisfied that they are properly lined up, then push harder to fill the mag with gas.

Stargazer

[WeskerAlbert]

Re: Gas gun issues

No upgrades, all stock. All i've changed are externals, custom slide and grips. Have a skeleton hammer i want fitted but havent heard from Zero yet after 2 weeks and 3 emails about it.. Will have to phone them. I tried to line the can up correctly with the angle of the valve but it probably just wasnt quite right. I'll keep trying it and if i get enough gas in will test fire with no bb's in and see if the slide works right or not. Hoping its just the gas and not a problem with the gun itself

[jfox61]

Re: Gas gun issues

Somewhere, I may be mistaken you say you swapped the internals from your clear gun. Is that correct? If so return the guns to their original state. It could be a parts issue.

Also try putting the old slide back on along with all other original parts. If it fires ok, add one part at a time. It may be a new part you put in there is faulty. Hopefully by a process of elimination you will find the faulty part if any.

When you rack the new slide back does it rack back easily? Also is the new custom slide metal? Changing from plastic to metal may affect the recoil, being heavier will mean more gas needs to be used. You may also need to upgrade other parts to cope with the slide.

The other thing may be as Hoggy says, a blocked gas inlet valve. TM's are quite notorious for not letting gas in easily. Do as he says fill as normal and push hard on the nub to release the gas you should get about a 1 to 2 second burst of high pressure. If you just get a quick whoosh and the nub felt easy to push then that will be the problem.

[WeskerAlbert]

Re: Gas gun issues

Yes i had to as my custom slide was just the slide, it had nothing inside it. When i got my new one however i switched the outer and inner barrels and took the new ones into my slide and the old ones into the new slide (one that came on this gun which is now on the clear m9) Most internals are therefore new apart from the blowback unit which came out of the clear m9, i didnt bother switching that over to save me having to rebuild the whole slide again. Im sure i put it all back together right, looks the same as my new slide. Could probably do with some silicon oil or greasing though but thats about it

Im going to try with the new slide and see if its any different. I cant until my sister brings it round as i gave it to her. Will also try firing mine with the old mag and try old mag and other slide together and see if anything changes

Yeah the slide is fine, moves no problem when no gas in it. When i cock it it stays back as the slide lock holds it but when i release it it slides back into place fine. My custom slide is plastic, the parts are made by Tokyo Marui too. Its the same size, shape and weight as my other 2 plastic slides so there shouldnt be any problems

I'll try that if i can get some gas in to see how the release feels. If i feel the pressure hopefully it will fire ok. I just wasnt sure about touching that bit as i read doing do can permanently damage the o-rings and seals due to freezing them. I'll press it gently though just to test for pressure

I'll try and test it tomorrow, havent had a chance to yet. Will try just gas first and see if maybe the problem was i just wasnt getting enough gas into the gun. If thats not the problem then i need my clear one brought over so i can test the parts on it