V2 gearbox upgrades

[kipper66]

hi guys

i've got a JG G3 and since my trigger mechanism has just gone in the gearbox i've been looking at what other upgrades i can get.

what would you lot recommend? since i am going for a DMR type of a gun with my G3 it would need to improve consistency of the gun.

preferably things that are available from the Z1 site. since i'm gonna be ordering/popping in to buy these things this week or next along with a new case and systema trigger set.


cheers

[ThatblokewiththeScar.]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

Your best option IMHO is to buy a brand new Tokyo Marui MP5-G3 gearbox leave it completely stock and drop that in. Then hunt around for a TM hop unit or at the very least a TM bucking.

The gearbox will be about £65 the bucking £5. The gearbox will run forever and a day and will be the most reliable rifle you have. Probably. If you then later on want to upgrade the bugger drop in some bearings and a spring then leave it be. This will cost you about the same as a few upgrade parts and will be more reliable and better made.

My First TM G3 ran stock for three years with it's original owner before it came to me and I only upgraded the power cause I had a spring handy when I serviced the gearbox. It would shoot as farther than most AEG's and you could empty a 2500 round drum mag without letting go of the trigger once. The TM box is almost perfect.

Plus you can sell the JG gearbox for parts on here and get some of your money back. :D

[kipper66]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

cheers, i thought about buying a TM or ICS gearbox instead of upgrading. since it upgrading worked out only a little more expensive than a new box, and i'll know whats in it.

but TM, as you said, seem to run forever. my hunt for a TM box continues

[ThatblokewiththeScar.]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

I have an ICS gun and its great but I would stay away from dropping their gearbox's into other makes of gun. Defo go with the TM then you will know it will always go off when you pull the trigger.

Phil...

[HunterAndy]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

If you're looking for accuracy improvements forget the gearbox.

Accuracy comes from The barrel you use

The hop up / rubber you use

And the quality of BB you use.



If you are intent on changing the gearbox the only differences will be in the compression parts, so piston, piston head, cylinder cylinder head and air nozzle and a spring upgrade to M100 to increase the FPS.

It will not make as much difference as the first 3 however.

[ThatblokewiththeScar.]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

Yeah he is looking for consistency first hence the TM gearbox. And as I mentioned above change to the TM hop unit or at least the TM Bucking.

[HunterAndy]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

Yeah he is looking for consistency first hence the TM gearbox. And as I mentioned above change to the TM hop unit or at least the TM Bucking.

Consistency also increases if gearbox parts are creating a uniform airflow, which is why upgrading the piston head/ air nozzle/ cylinder etc Can help accuracy.

If you imagine a stock gearbox possibly creating turbulent air in the barrel, whereas upgraded gearbox with a more consistent flow of air, less likely to blow the BB off course upon leaving the barrel.

Basically, it's the cheaper things that actually make more of a difference, BBs you buy anyway so the way I see it when I play is spend £1 extra on better quality BBs, get more than £1 worth of improvement on accuracy.

Same goes for an inner barrel, pay an extra £10 for the best barrel, and maybe an extra £5 on hop, reap the rewards of a much more accurate rifle, and save yourself the frustration that people are outranging you in the process!

[ThatblokewiththeScar.]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

Consistency also increases if gearbox parts are creating a uniform airflow, which is why upgrading the piston head/ air nozzle/ cylinder etc Can help accuracy.

If you imagine a stock gearbox possibly creating turbulent air in the barrel, whereas upgraded gearbox with a more consistent flow of air, less likely to blow the BB off course upon leaving the barrel.

Because of the inherent poor air-seal properties of an airsoft gearbox the flow rate dynamics of what is essentially an open system will always have vortex dynamics which can not be detected or removed from such systems. This can therefore in this instance be said to be irrelevant. Where this theory has merit is in long stroke air systems with higher pressure such as those experienced in single bolt action rifles. Where the Volume air pressure is such that the amount of flow is larger than the amount of required expelled air, The dynamics of this flow rate could be said to benefit from tuned exhaust flow overpressure but the amount of measurable vortex play would again be almost undetectable.

Basically, it's the cheaper things that actually make more of a difference, BBs you buy anyway so the way I see it when I play is spend £1 extra on better quality BBs, get more than £1 worth of improvement on accuracy.

I totally agree and have said many many times that learning how you gun performs and what it likes and dislikes is of far greater value than the pursuit of performance from spending cash on upgrades. However the OP's question was one of consistency (Cheap internals) not performance.

Same goes for an inner barrel, pay an extra £10 for the best barrel, and maybe an extra £5 on hop, reap the rewards of a much more accurate rifle, and save yourself the frustration that people are out ranging you in the process!

Again we are talking about a machine that farts air down a tube to expel a blockage. A clean barrel will in many case's give far better performance than any amount of money spent on the best barrel. Remember also that tighter barrels can and do decrease the effective range of many guns and the tighter you go the less performance you can expect under certain conditions. 6.00 and 6.01 barrels will increase the accuracy of your gun by a huge amount but can also half the effective range of the gun. IPSC Race guns are in many cases useless for skirmishing as they wont hit anything past 20 meters. As per the original recommendation changing the JG hop for a TM hop will do the job. The OP has not asked about TB barrels so no advice was given.

[kipper66]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

blokewiththescar.... cheers for all your help!

although i'm new to airsoft, that dosnt mean i dont know how things work and why they work. and i'd rather have consistency over some guns which produce the odd shot thats super-accurate or has a massive range, but in general fall short.

i currently have a 6.03 in the G3, but may purchase a TK twist barrell, and it seems it could be worth the extra dollar. but gettin the gun working again with a decent gearbox is the priority.

i'll probs gonna order the TM hop unit, box, nub, and maybe a few other random goodies.

[HunterAndy]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

Because of the inherent poor air-seal properties of an airsoft gearbox the flow rate dynamics of what is essentially an open system will always have vortex dynamics which can not be detected or removed from such systems. This can therefore in this instance be said to be irrelevant. Where this theory has merit is in long stroke air systems with higher pressure such as those experienced in single bolt action rifles. Where the Volume air pressure is such that the amount of flow is larger than the amount of required expelled air, The dynamics of this flow rate could be said to benefit from tuned exhaust flow overpressure but the amount of measurable vortex play would again be almost undetectable.

I didn't say the benefits were big, I just stated there are benefits there, and precision parts with tighter tolerances made by aftermarket companies do make SOME, not Normally noticeable, unless you want to get your DMR working as effectively as you can. improvements to airflow, as G3s are un-ported cylinders, and 470mm length barrels, with the nozzle being the only open factor; having a well fitted one does make the difference. I'm saying this out of experience having owned and tuned my g3 for the first 3 years of playing, you can theorise as much as you want.

However the OP's question was one of consistency (Cheap internals) not performance.

If you read the whole post he says he also wants a DMR, and i'm naturally trying to help him get a more DMR orientated rifle. he didn't actually differ between consistency of working parts or consistency of shot in the first post. Naturally specifying he wanted a DMR, i assumed consistency of shot would be more of a priority, so don't rule it out.

Again we are talking about a machine that farts air down a tube to expel a blockage. A clean barrel will in many case's give far better performance than any amount of money spent on the best barrel. Remember also that tighter barrels can and do decrease the effective range of many guns and the tighter you go the less performance you can expect under certain conditions. 6.00 and 6.01 barrels will increase the accuracy of your gun by a huge amount but can also half the effective range of the gun. IPSC Race guns are in many cases useless for skirmishing as they wont hit anything past 20 meters. As per the original recommendation changing the JG hop for a TM hop will do the job. The OP has not asked about TB barrels so no advice was given.

Just because he hasn't asked for something doesn't mean he doesn't need it.
The OP did not ask for hop up improvement either, but you gave advice for it.
I would appreciate it if you wouldn't piece apart my advice as if I'm clueless.
I don't need the explanation that a tighter barrel is not as effective as a low tolerance machined barrel.
To assume when I said "best barrel" I assumed a 6.01 is naive. When I talk about the best barrels, I talk about the lowest tolerance barrels, such as PDI and prometheus, the former being 6.05 barrels, but at a much lower tolerance. Also assuming I would just stick a high end barrel in and not clean it- is patronising, a clean high end barrel will always out perform an unclean standard one.

As you can probably tell, i'm quite annoyed that you feel the need to explain this all to me. I was keeping it concise in aid of the OP, but this post is just for you.

[ThatblokewiththeScar.]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

I didn't say the benefits were big, I just stated there are benefits there, and precision parts with tighter tolerances made by aftermarket companies do make SOME, not Normally noticeable, unless you want to get your DMR working as effectively as you can. improvements to airflow, as G3s are un-ported cylinders, and 470mm length barrels, with the nozzle being the only open factor; having a well fitted one does make the difference. I'm saying this out of experience having owned and tuned my g3 for the first 3 years of playing, you can theorise as much as you want.

Thats fine. But the OP asked a Technical Question in the Tech section so just dismissing advice from another poster out of hand with out giving any reason is less of a theory more of a guess. If you disagree with advice given by other members then explain where that poster may of made a mistake and make a corrected post that will help with the technical issue. Dont just say "forget the gearbox" Just because you read something into the post that was not there.

If you read the whole post he says he also wants a DMR, and i'm naturally trying to help him get a more DMR orientated rifle. he didn't actually differ between consistency of working parts or consistency of shot in the first post. Naturally specifying he wanted a DMR, i assumed consistency of shot would be more of a priority, so don't rule it out.

I did read the post and the OP said he was going for Consistancy! He also said he had a busted gearbox and the title says V2 Gearbox Upgrades. You assumed that he only wants consistancy in range and accuracy becasue he mentioned a DMR! This is you not reading and not understading the post. Plus I fail to see how saying that accuracy comes from the barrel the hop and the BB's is giving technical advice to somone asking about a V2 Gearbox Upgrade.

Just because he hasn't asked for something doesn't mean he doesn't need it.

He didn't ask for alot of things! He didnt ask for directions to Mecca so does that mean he needs to be told how to upgrade his sat-nav?[/QUOTE]

The OP did not ask for hop up improvement either, but you gave advice for it.

I did not give advice on hop up improvment for range or accuracy! I suggested he found a TM hop unit and Bucking to aid consistency inline with his original post. I made no assumption that he did not already have the knowledge or was unable to discover for himself that building a DMR may require additional work with the barrel, hop, ammo combinaion. [/QUOTE]

I would appreciate it if you wouldn't piece apart my advice as if I'm clueless.

I did not piece apart your advice, As you gave no advice!

I don't need the explanation that a tighter barrel is not as effective as a low tolerance machined barrel.

Again you are making assumptions. I was not trying to explain anything! I was saying that just spending £10 as you suggested is not nessesery as the small gains from this dubious action may be out performed by simply cleaning the standard barrel.

To assume when I said "best barrel" I assumed a 6.01 is naive.

I made no such assumption. You did not understand my post and assumed I was making assumptions about you.

When I talk about the best barrels, I talk about the lowest tolerance barrels, such as PDI and prometheus, the former being 6.05 barrels, but at a much lower tolerance.

Then perhaps you should type what you mean!

Also assuming I would just stick a high end barrel in and not clean it- is patronising,

Again I made no such assumption. I was pointing out a simple and verifiable fact that was not aimed at anyone but is a simple fact of airsoft mechanics. Try reading the post again.

a clean high end barrel will always out perform an unclean standard one.

Do you have any data or proof for that statement? Or is that another assumption?

As you can probably tell, i'm quite annoyed that you feel the need to explain this all to me.

I felt no compunction to explain anything to you. I was replying to a post that had no relevance to the question being asked. And if you are annoyed by that then either dont post or post something relevent.

I was keeping it concise in aid of the OP

I fail to see any part of your post that was concise or aided the OP in any way what so ever!

but this post is just for you.

This post is for anyone bored enough to care.


You claim that paying more gets better results.

So try this.

Retailer-A charges £40 for a standard DBoys inner barrel. Retailer-B charges £35 for a Systema inner barrel. By your recomendation buying the D-Boys barrel is better because it cost more. Can you see where your "advice" falls short?

[kipper66]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

now now ladies.

i've just bought a marui GB for the G3. its an mp5 GB tho but i can nick the things out of my JG gearbox (well, its only the cylinder, and selector plate)

cheers for the advice guys

[ThatblokewiththeScar.]

Re: V2 gearbox upgrades

Glad you got the gearbox you wanted. :D

And hey it's an open (ish) forum and whats the point if we cant disagree occasionally. :p

Nothing personal meant by it and no harm done.