Very high rps... What's the point?

[thekonassure]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

on semi really high rof also gets amazingly better trigger response and can really compensate of how inaccurate airsoft guns can be sometimes.

Oh man I`m always trying to get to woodland games as they seam way more tactical then a lot of cqb games can be sometimes as the range issues come into play so you can use snipers and gunners for cover and stuff.

I`m not a massive paintball fan mate but you do get really really sound tactical players in paintball hell even in airball where the whole "map" is made up from inflatable cover you still get very tactical paintball teams and players the word for the people you speak of are "SPEEDBALLERS" I would not even put sprayers in the same pile as speedballers as some sprayers are just laying down tactical cover fire ofcourse at the time it can feel like their just being a d*ck well till a mate of there`s shoots you in the back lol

[Icebass]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Well my gearbox is throwing out around 40rps on a single sector gear setup, fires flawlessly on both and due to the lack on wear of any of the internals I doubt anything will happen anytime soon.

My reason for wanting such a high speed setup was people not taking their hits, I believe its something that is becoming such a common site in airsoft due to the older "elite" players deciding when they want to respawn because they're way to good to get hit (obviously) and the new kids thinking they're in cod and r 1337....if they want to cheat then they can have a little bit of pain. I also wanted as near instant trigger response as I could get without going down the systema route due to playing at a cqb site.

Should be funny when I eventually go down the dsg route. Then people will really start bitching.

[thekonassure]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Yeah I hate it when people don`t take there hits so much so that if someone tags me long range I hold up my hand and point at them and give them a little thumbs up just to be sure that they are sure I have taken my hit even more so if it was a single shot in tricky conditions.

So Icebass what set up are you running ? 13:1 short stroked with an 11.1v or 14.8v Id assume ? I remember hearing that guy had cracked 70rps without having to go dsg yet but that is pretty dam extreme.

I do like the noise a dsg makes on semi and I think that your sector gear is better balanced so your bearings should have the stress on them more central regardless of how hard your pushing the rof on them.

[happyal]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

I've been building a DSG setup, it's not too fast yet as I've still got alot of parts still to come. It's currently firing approx 45rps using a 11.1v Lipo and don't want too much more, aiming for low 50's when it's finished because it's going to be a Skirmish weapon and there's no point going much higher.

My reasons for building it is because I hate high rof gun, they are so stupid and have no point at all in airsoft. So I'm building one to prove that point. Also if they are allowed at my local site then I might as well have the fastest one. I will say that once you start they are a bit addictive, always trying to push it a little bit further.

[LazyMcCrazy]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Very high rps... What's the point?

Answer: To keep heads down.

[thekonassure]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

I've been building a DSG setup, it's not too fast yet as I've still got alot of parts still to come. It's currently firing approx 45rps using a 11.1v Lipo and don't want too much more, aiming for low 50's when it's finished because it's going to be a Skirmish weapon and there's no point going much higher.

My reasons for building it is because I hate high rof gun, they are so stupid and have no point at all in airsoft. So I'm building one to prove that point. Also if they are allowed at my local site then I might as well have the fastest one. I will say that once you start they are a bit addictive, always trying to push it a little bit further.

What`s your set up ? as 45rps on an 11.1v for a dsg sounds a bit slow but I guess if you have a really slow motor in there at the moment it would be quite slow. You should be able to push 50rps on a 7.4v allowing you room for more mah`s making the battery last longer making the gun more skirmish-able.

See my aim in a dsg build is normally around 40 to 50rps on a 7.4v to me that`s the limit of what`s not out of order to skirmish with but then you have the option of pushing 70rps when you step up to an 11.1v.

Also I just thought that doing a super high speed dsg set up then using a 3.7v bat and ending up with 20 to 30rps might be really useful in guns that have almost no space for a battery.

Anyone ever tried using a 3.7v ?

[Kensai]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Agree with what other have said, its trigger response for me (I use a TM AUG High Cycle and a FAMAS, two high ROF AEGs). I don't often go full auto. Its not always required and saves ammo. I only go full auto if someone is moving very fast or I think they are not taking their hits.

[sparrowhawk]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

that is a bit slow, metal piston, and piston head with the bearings attached + small battery, low grade wiring and tamiya connector, could slow it down i suppose

[thekonassure]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

that is a bit slow, metal piston, and piston head with the bearings attached + small battery, low grade wiring and tamiya connector, could slow it down i suppose

Maybe he`s using a ssg as he`s still waiting for the dsg to come lol

[Icebass]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Yeah I hate it when people don`t take there hits so much so that if someone tags me long range I hold up my hand and point at them and give them a little thumbs up just to be sure that they are sure I have taken my hit even more so if it was a single shot in tricky conditions.

So Icebass what set up are you running ? 13:1 short stroked with an 11.1v or 14.8v Id assume ? I remember hearing that guy had cracked 70rps without having to go dsg yet but that is pretty dam extreme.

I do like the noise a dsg makes on semi and I think that your sector gear is better balanced so your bearings should have the stress on them more central regardless of how hard your pushing the rof on them.

This is the current setup (changing a few bits in it before the weekend).

Modify 8mm Taurs Gearbox (changing to ultimate gearbox 8mm box)
Modify 8mm ceramic bearings (changing to ultimate 8mm bearings)
Shs bearing spring guide
Shs 14 tooth full metal piston 2 teeth SS'd (chainging to supershooter 14 tooth 3 teeth SS'd)
JG orange piston head (changing to supershooter red vented piston head)
Shs m110 spring
Promethious Cylinder
Ultimate Cylinder Head
Modify air nozzle
Shs 13:1 SS'd 2 teeth (changing to Supershooter 13:1 SS's 3 teeth)
Modify ar latch
Classic Army trigger mech with an ab mosfet
Shs Ultra high torque motor.
11.1 2000mah 15c

Changing the box due to getting better results on with the ultimate box in the builds im doing for other people. Changing the other stuff because i want to see if the supershooter stuff is any good. It looks amazing like, the sector and spur gears have bearings on the axle's and the piston head looks to be of very high quality. I'd say with a 14.8 i could crack 50rps but im happy enough with the way it is.

Not sure about the 3.7, something tells me it would have problems powering the motor.

[dave38x]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Okay, I've sort of managed to follow this as a newcomer to the forum/airsoft as a whole, ive got a few questions/points:

DSG? What does that stand for?
SSG? The same question

Surely at some of the RoFs you guys are hitting your piston cannot actually reach the forward position before the gear tries to draw it back again? How is this mitigated?

Secondly, on the wiring/connector front: From an electrical background, the only times wiring or a connector will affect your RoF is if you have a dry soldered joint,VERY thin wiring, crimped joins instead of soldered ones (god forbid), oxide on your contacts or worn out contacts. Deans are rated at 10A continuous and Tamiya are rated at 9a, however you are never truly going to get a constant current even blatting off on full auto.

Finally, my thoughts on RoF - if it's accurate I find it more enjoyable. If I have the money some day I'll probably mosfet up a very high RoF gun but control said rate to the rate of fire the weapon actually fires at, just for the trigger response.

[Icebass]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

DSG = Double sector gear, some guy, from america i believe, came up with the idea of creating a sector gear with 2 sets of teeth to draw the piston back twice with one revoloution of the sector gear.
SSG = Single sector gear, the basic sector gear

Yes at the rof we're hitting the piston would have problems, this is why we short stroke the piston and sector gear and use a larger spring. For really high rof some people even "swiss cheese" the piston to reduce the weight (drill holes in it).

Im not really from an electrical background so only know what im told, i was told to use 16awg silicone wire due to its flexability and capacity, i use deans due to the fact that i've had tamiya's melt.....deans dont.

[sparrowhawk]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

dsg= dual sector gear
ssg= single sector gear



ninjered

deans melt only when you solder than badly, ie put a hot solder iron on them, and they soon melt

[Dwarfy]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

last time i checked it only took 1 BB to take someone out

I very rare use more than 1 SCAR-H mag in a game, i prob spend 70% of games on single shot.

[thekonassure]

Re: Very high rps... What's the point?

Dwarfy it may shock you to know that I`ve had full auto games where with a 40rps gun I did not even empty 1 300rd m4 hi cap and that was in a 30min game still its nice to be able to do a "swipe burst" and hit 4 people at range with one pass lol

Mini tammiya`s can be really rubbish at holding current and even an shs ut motor has been known to draw close to 30amps peak in an extreme set up.

Yeah deans don`t melt and tbh I think they can hold 30amps maybe even 60amps where as anything over 20 and mini tam`s just seam to melt.

Dave on a DSG set up your sector gear is shorted then normal normally anything from 7 to 9 teeth around half as many as a stock set up this means that "pre-engagement" will not happen as easy as a normal set up, then also the 2nd and sometimes 3rd teeth are removed from the piston to stop the sector gear engaging early. As they piston is only getting pulled back half as much as a stock one you need to use a much stronger spring or a spacer on the spring to increase the spring pressure to get the same fps as your would in a ssg set up.

Also it normally means in a dsg set up that you should have a barrel under around 360mm otherwise you get issues with the fact that you need more air volume to fully launch the bb.

Cool Icebass have you tried many 9mm gearbox`s ? I`m looking for someone who`s happy to take on a few dsg builds as my workshop is some what lacking I get away with doing a ssg build but if I broke one of my dsg boxes I`d be pissed off also its just so tricky for me to deal with the spring pressure needed and get the gearbox back together.

Drop me a pm if you feel like talking on some work, I am waiting to hear from Toolbox as he took over from midas but it`s been a few days since I emailed him so I have no idea how busy he is.